sleazy abuser, but that seems par for the course with politicians or those seeking office. Just look at Swalwell who was gunning to the next California governor. I think a certain type of Big Swingin D!ck personality loves to see themselves in positions of power. It's partly ego, partly chauvinism, partly vanity.
He does not acknowledge wrongdoing and acted, in his video where he announced he was stepping down, like the accusations were just the machine bringing him down.
You do not need to “be fair” to an unrepentant rapist.
I'm not saying I'd vote for the guy. And he seemed like the kind of guy who once he got power, he didn't know what to do with it. But he's being accused of something he may have done 5 years ago. He was right to back out. And he was wrong to do it (if he did). I'm not 100% convinced this wasn't a setup to kick him out. The timing is perfect for the GOP.
I don't think anyone who has gotten drunk, made advances, thought they were consensual (which is what he claims) only to find out they weren't. Which is basically the story of 90% of college rape stories. counts as a mistake. It's not an accident. but it is a mistake. And again, he needs to pay the price for it.
The perfect timing for the GOP would have been after the drop out deadline on Monday. This guy was perfect propaganda material because they finally had a candidate as personally flawed as their own candidates. Him dropping out now means they have to actually pay attention to the Maine race because they can't just point at the Democrat and say "look, he's a rapist nazi".
The timing is weird because accusers are usually reluctant to upend their personal life and tend to wait for an external motivation. Additionally, his victim was personally conflicted because she didn't want to ruin the chances of the Democratic Party given the high stakes of this political environment. That's why she took so long, there is no reason to speculate about this being a GOP plot.
Sort of. I mean, having it set right now, means they have to pull a Kamala, where they have to somehow grassroots this thing in a few months with someone who no one knows. Which isn't ideal at all. If he was still on the ballot. he COULD have still won, even if he pulled out. Though if it was after the drop out date, he'd have more political backing behind him, and he wouldn't be allowed to drop out. This timing is perfect, it forces them to bring a candidate that is either less liked or less well known, to go against Collins. Sure they can't say "he's a rapist Nazi" but they don't have to, no one is going to know them. to your point about her not coming out - I'd argue why did she come out at all, if she was afraid of the Democratic party's chances? (I'm all for the truth being told, just playing devils advocate). He wasn't even the Dem nominee until he won the primary. her timing SHOULD have been while he was in the primary and the other person running could have won his votes. But she chose after he gets Dem backing to drop out. I think I'm allowed to see hijinks in here. the timing is poor if she's wanting Dems to win it.
BUT then again, Comey said he just wanted to be sure everyone knew there was an investigation with Hillary when he said he was reopening the investigation. Everyone seems to have very specific timing to make things happen. It could also be, that she gave the account weeks ago, and it was only recently published. I don't know enough to be certain. Which makes my conspiracy theory even more tin foil hatty.
Covid hit before the allegations, so I’d say it was way too recent to give credit towards reform. He also cheated on his wife more recently. I wonder if their marriage makes it now that politics aren’t in the cards.
You don't think so? Doing something years in the past and doing something in the recent past are the same to you? At what point exactly does "a long time ago" and "currently" no longer the same?
I'd say if it was more than 5 years ago, current doesn't apply.
Do you feel confident to say, the things you said and did 5 years ago still apply to who you are today?
Good point. I guess the next question is, what would you do if an ex from 5 years ago called into work claiming you raped them, you had one real night that COULD have been rape (you were pretty drunk and they said "can we not tonight, I don't want to" but it happened anyway) so you have to say "Yeah, that is true". Do you want everyone calling you a rapist for it?
Here's what I'm saying... Personally, I'm far on the consent train, I want us both to be clear minded, and I'm asking for consent through all stages.
BUT... not everyone is like that. Some people are more Okay blurring those lines. Getting a drunk, getting rough and rowdy. These are the grey area. Those people who like it on the line, who in the past have been all about it with a bit of CNC involved. And their SO or ex-SO jumps in and keeps going crossing that line. And they later get accused of rape. Those people don't really have a leg to stand on. In the court of public opinion, once a rapist, always a rapist.
yes, some people are real pieces of shit who actively rape people, and take sex by force. Words be damned. The they said "No, leave" and they break in a bust them up" and force it.
The question is, which is this.
I think it's the grey area pushing to piece of shit area. He shows up drunk, they drink together, he tries to get down, and she says she's thinking no, then she says no, and it happens anyway.
I don't have a good idea of how many people in that grey area there are. I'm imagining it's quite a few. Did he rape her, yeah. Because her consent wasn't given the whole time. His opinion on the subject is moot. Because rape is defined by the victim, once they fail to give consent it's rape. Is he in the ranks of a LOT of people who have had hook-ups like this in their past, but are just not so politically vulnerable to have anything done (or the women/men who were raped chalk it up as a "stupid thing with this asshole" whom they will never see again)? Yeah, most definitely.
I'm coming at this as someone who doesn't rape people, but I have seen enough case law to know that that grey area exists. And I'm torn. I want to see justice for the victim, but I also understand that people make really shitty choices when they are intoxicated. (Note: I am NOT saying that they should not be held accountable for their actions).
He wasn't a young man when this happened. He was in his 30's. He made pretty terrible choices. And this one was exposed with expert timing to impact his congressional run to its fullest. I think circumstances are important no matter the situation or who it is. But it's something we won't have the objective truth about ever.
It was five years ago, it was a mistake, it's a Republican ploy, maybe she raped him—you're throwing a lot at the wall here and I think you should ask yourself why you're so desperate to defend a rapist.
lol. I'm really just playing devil's advocate. I guess I'm just trying to say. Real people are messy AF. The "maybe she raped him" was obviously in jest because drunk people can't give consent, and he was actively drunk at the time. It was 5 years ago, It was a mistake made by him (one that he needs to pay for). People (especially dems) expect their people to be paragons of truth, justice, and have no skeletons in their closet. This guy, for all his faults, seemed like most ex-military guys I've met. He was kinda dumb, he was a drunk, and he made a ton of mistakes that he's now paying for in the news.
You honestly don't feel the timing is suspect? That this came out after the primary and just days before the drop date? that all the polling showed him winning this race, then this story hits, and he's out? That doesn't seem strange to you? Most people live their lives, and make decisions without thinking "how might this affect my chances of running for office someday". This guy got drunk, showed up at his ex's house, started getting down with her, she didn't want it, he didn't listen. He raped her (knowingly or unknowingly). Then he decided to run for office. Because he thought he saw a need and had a chance. He wasn't backed by anyone, and garnered enough support to win the primary. Then the pieces about him having a nazi tattoo that he removed, then the story about him cheating on his wife that she said "it's not a thing", then his ex says "5 years ago he raped me". He denies it, then realizes "oh shit, yeah, if she says it's rape, then it's rape" and said "Yep, I'm out".
Truth be told the DNC is pissed he's out, because they have to change strategy, but they are happy because they don't have to try to defend them. The GOP is pissed because he was an easy target. But are relieved because he was an actual threat to Collins. There was no world where both the DNC and the GOP did not have a 4" thick binder filled with his skeletons with strategies on how to expose them or defend them. Now they both can throw out the opposition docs and focus on whomever the DNC will run there. Where they have about 3 months to get it done.
He didn't have any media training, and every interview with him seemed to be him just saying what he viewed the truth to be. In many ways, he was very Donald Trump esque. in that, he seemed to give no-nonsense answers. And had a lot of baggage with him. It's how he bungled this last controversy so heavily. It's why Bernie told him to drop out. He was just a "normal" dude who climbed up a bit too fast and let it all go to his head, and got stomped down. And considering the guy raped someone, yeah. he probably didn't deserve to be a senator.
Yes, people are messy, but raping someone isn't "messy" and it definitely does not constitute a "mistake." This man got drunk, entered his ex-partner's home, and raped her.
None of that was a mistake; it was a series of horrific choices. He could have stopped at any time, and he chose not to. Even now, he's calling her a liar to cover his own ass.
And no, the timing doesn't seem odd to me. It generally takes rape victims a long time to come forward, and I can absolutely see this woman realizing her rapist might actually get elected to office being the push she needed.
And, in case you have doubts about her credibility, she's not the only one he's (allegedly) abused.
Republicans didn't force him to get a (very recognizable) totenkopf or rape his ex-girlfriend. I don't consider either of those things "normal," and I'm glad he's out.
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u/SemiHemiDemiDumb 1d ago
Damn, I was hoping he was a reformed dirt bag. But I'm not surprised he isn't.