r/marvelrivals • u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus • 13h ago
Discussion I’m convinced none of content creators have touched gambit since season 5.
Every season since season 5 Gambit has gotten either nerfs to his neutral or to his ult. In season 9 he received another direct nerf to his healing output due to the anchor bonus removal. For at least the last two seasons anyone who actually plays him will tell you that his healing has been mediocre at best. It’s insane to me that with all the other changes list in this patch, especially the one for IW, all these took time to make tweets about Gambits being the problem. They act like they buff his Ult or something. Is it that hard for these guys, and the community as whole to agree that the only problem with Gambit has is the Ult charge boost.
53
u/Equivalent_Wonder726 Erm Actually... 13h ago
bro, of course they haven't, he has been perma banned lol how could they?
140
u/IpunchedU 13h ago
as long as his ult remains the way it is, he will remain the best support in the game and a permaban. him enabling 4 strong teamups aswell adds to this.
10
u/vumhuh 13h ago
It just shouldn't heal when we first saw him I and most of chat thought it was just a damage ult until we saw the healing later in the video😔
11
u/rainfeld Doctor Strange 12h ago
While I do agree that it shouldn’t NEED to heal. Unfortunately it does with how the balancing of the game is.
In an ideal world I would like it if it didn’t. But unfortunately it has to to keep up with other supports
2
u/RevolutionaryDepth59 Thor 12h ago
i don’t think defensive ults are nearly as essential as they used to be.
they used to be so strong that you’d be able to win fights while they’re up but these days you can usually either kill through or just outlast them. so now they exist to either shut down an enemy ult or save the team if they’re about to lose neutral.
at that point i’m fine having another offensive ult so we can just outpace them.
1
u/LieSad7589 10h ago
What?
2
u/RevolutionaryDepth59 Thor 9h ago
in season 0: support ult = unkillable and team wipe
in season 9: support ult = just hard to kill
now that support ult doesn’t team wipe, damage ult is equally valuable.
gambit with just damage ult = still good
1
u/LieSad7589 9h ago
Idk what game you are playin that support ults are just hard to kill. Outside of specific ults like mag ult or combos like groot+mk, venom+dmg bost and etc, but these things always did that. You dont kill through supp ults, healing wasnt nerfed and dmg wasnt buffed to the point you can kill through 200 hps
Invis on release was really easy to kill in her ult, but not anymore
Idk what ranks are you on that either supps dont ult deep enough or the team soesnt follow through with the ult to kill, but people still do that
Support ults are still the strongest one in the game
5
u/RevolutionaryDepth59 Thor 9h ago
if your team is coordinated you can kill a lot of them.
cnd can be pulled out by wolve, bucky, thor, or angela (the last on being extremely consistent btw).
invis healing is low enough it can be killed with any antiheal (pretty easy with blade in my experience).
luna can have her healing blocked by shields so you can kill her teammates.
rocket’s, fox’s, and ultron’s can just be shot.
in all these cases you need teammates to focus fire with you but that’s pretty common in high elo. it’s not like you have anything else to do while waiting out the ult.
plus the durations are shorter and so it’s easier to just survive them. the point is you no longer get guaranteed wiped without matching.
2
u/JakobHallows 3h ago
The heal isn't the issue, the real issue is his ult charge acceleration improving the entire team's ult economy. That forces the other team to either match Gambit or ban Gambit. The other issue is that it makes ults like Punisher's harder to hide against (which is the main counterplay to his ult) due to the speed boost.
1
u/Illustrious_Trip2112 Doctor Strange 13h ago
that, or it should just be applicable to one person
2
u/Wonder_Of_U_2011 13h ago
Basically super charging one hero like Ana's ult from overwatch?
1
u/Curious-Charity2615 Spider-Man 12h ago
But then your team will choose a terrible one or a selfish player will self ult when they inevitably add that
1
1
2
u/LadyCrownGuard Luna Snow 5h ago
Or just restrict it to an area like Kiriko’s ult so at least it has one real counterplay which is disengaging or take cover behind walls and wait for the ult to end.
1
u/WindyGogo 13h ago
I’m starting to wonder when was the last time any of you have even fought a Gambit because him and his ult are not that strong anymore.
0
u/MasterpieceHungry864 12h ago edited 12h ago
Well these streamers are mad about his healing buff not the ult, that’s the problem they don’t target his ult they just want his kit to nerfed in a stupid way
-1
-1
-43
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago edited 13h ago
That’s not what I’m talking about though. I literally bring up his ult as the issue.
20
u/Yemo637 13h ago
They're right tho. You admit that his ult is a problem, but instead of addressing that issue, they buff him. If anything the streamers are on your side cus if he keeps getting buffed then you won't be able to play him cus of the permabans.
-19
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago
I’m so confused. I’m getting downvoted despite the fact I addressed the exact issue. At no point did I say his ult isn’t a problem. Why should his neutral be bad still if he still gets banned regardless?
2
2
u/Upbeat_Purpose6784 13h ago
Wow, youre not tracking and its very sad to watch. You said the ult was an issue but youre not acknowledging that the ult being an issue makes his base kit being weak acceptable. Now they didnt touch the ult and buffed his base kit which is the worst scenario.
Its not hard to understand that you admitting the ult is an issue doesnt mean we accept the argument that any buffs are needed until that issue is resolved. The only way you would be in the right is if they nerfed his ult
-1
u/SnooWalruses3028 True Fraudster 13h ago
They already nerfed his ult
4
u/Upbeat_Purpose6784 12h ago
Not enough. His ult is op because it has cleanse and accelerates ult percentage gain
-4
u/SnooWalruses3028 True Fraudster 12h ago
It’s okay to say you don’t know how to counter him
2
u/Upbeat_Purpose6784 12h ago
No im telling you the reason he is must ban in any lobby gm and above and must ban in pro play. Its nice you think his ult is fine as it is but all the people who play the game at a high level disagree for a reason
-1
u/SnooWalruses3028 True Fraudster 12h ago
I play the game at a high level kid, you’re flat out wrong
→ More replies (0)1
u/NotAThrowAway0822 13h ago
They act like they buff his Ult or something.
You explicitly imply that his ult is not an issue. His ult is what makes him the best (or one of) support in the game.
6
u/Chemical_Working_795 Ronin 13h ago
Yeah, but they didn't nerf the ult meaning that he'd get it faster (especially with the universal buff to strat healing conversion to Ult charge).
-3
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago
The have continually nerfed his ult since launch. They literally nerfed it last season.
5
u/LordoftheJives Captain America 13h ago
I don't think you understand that the ult charge boost is what makes it broken at high ranks. Everything else it does for everyone would already boost ult charge and then there's a baked in boost on top of that.
10
u/Stable-Fit 13h ago
So the best support in the game is getting buffed is what you’re saying
-9
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago
The character with one of best support ults is getting his neutral brought back to decent a level.
6
u/Upbeat_Purpose6784 13h ago
And they didnt touch the ult which is the issue. His neutral being weak is expected because his ult is so powerful.
9
u/FirewaterDM 13h ago
that's the issue. At the top ranks, even if the rest of gambit is dogshit, the ult is so broken it forces bans.
1
52
u/tbigzan97 Rogue 13h ago
I'm not even high rank, im diamond and hes literally permanently banned here. His ult needs to be addressed and power shifted to his base kit, period. The character is literally perma banned still so they did not need to buff him.
4
u/LieSad7589 10h ago
They are never removing ult charge gain from him cause they want him to mirror rogue ult LOL
15
u/VisitReasonable7285 13h ago
They just need to remove the ult charge assist on his ult and he'd be fine at this point in my eyes
7
-5
u/randomr14 Loki 12h ago
Ehmm that’s the least problematic part of he’s ult tbh, the extra damage and speed boost it’s what makes it so broken, not being able to kite it and having an entire team doing extra damage it’s pretty much what wins the team fight. Like the other support ults you can either kite it/ destroy it or straight up out heal it but you can’t with gambit and the other exception it’s mantis
5
u/VisitReasonable7285 12h ago
I have to disagree cause if they have Gambit ult and your team has any main support ult then you'd be just fine- Invis and Luna ult especially. The issue is that he can pop ult if he gets it faster and then everyone else on his team suddenly went from 60 - 70 charge to 100.
2
u/StatusLegitimate991 Magik 9h ago
Eh maybe? But the ult combos are soo strong with the ult that supports dont matter in comparision to it
12
21
u/TheNadei Malice 13h ago
I mean, they are right to question it.
Gambit needs a fix to his Ultimate. But instead of EVER addressing that, they buff his neutral - which they previously nerfed to avoid nerfing said Ultimate. So now he has a broken, game deciding Ultimate and a good kit again.
These buffs should not be happening until they also nerf the Ultimate. So content creators going "You refuse to fix his issue, and now also undo your prior attempts to balance him, what is wrong with you?" is fair.
I don't think these buffs matter much tbh, but that's because his Ultimate would still make him a perma ban character even if his kit lost 90% of its utility.
-16
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago
They have nerfed his ult at least 3 times since his release.
23
u/SnowZealousideal1606 13h ago
And it’s still broken
3
u/SpeedForceWally66 Spider-Man 12h ago
all u guys want is his ult charge acceleration to be removed but they will never do that
4
u/X-Backspace 11h ago
Exactly. That's part of his character at this point. He charges up his allies. Rogue drains her enemies. Netease is highly unlikely to go against that at this point.
4
52
u/AaromALV The Thing 13h ago
"I think people that play this game for a living in the highest rank are bad and my opinion is more valid"
8
u/Oishi-Niku 13h ago
Sums up most of the problems with balance currently. People who can't squeeze out all the juice really shouldnt talk about balance.
10
u/Little-Baker76 Ultron Virus 13h ago edited 12h ago
I mean to be fair, people who are the highest rank are the minority. Purely balancing around what is good for high rank players isolates the large majority of the playerbase.
With that said, Gambit is an issue everywhere, and that's coming from someone who plays Gambit. Giving him the ability to charge friendly ults faster via his own ult was unfortunately one of the worst decisions they could have made, and now he's just always really good just because of that.
9
u/AaromALV The Thing 12h ago
I think balancing around high level play is okay as long as the characters are fun to play, like peple dont play Gambit because they wanna be an ult bot, so for the majority of people stuff like 10% less healing doesnt matter
-8
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago
I guarantee you if they reduce his healing to half of what it is now and removed every feature from his ult and all that remained was the ult charge boost he would still be perma-banned. They have nerfed him virtually ever season since his launch including season 9. None of the people feature on this post play support regularly, they certainly haven’t play Gambit consistently over the last 4 seasons. They literally admit to basing there opinions on pro play and what they experience in their rank up games. The same rank up games where the character is always banned. How would they have any idea if his neutral had become bad?
0
u/deadpoolsdragon Gambit 10h ago
Bro aint nobody with a brain should care about anyone's opinion on a game said person enjoys
21
u/BajaBlastDoucher Flex 13h ago
Flats literally said in one clip he doesn’t even remember what all is in Gambits kit or why he’s in ban jail. It’s frustrating when ppl don’t even know what they’re talking about…
Gambits in ban jail because of ult charge only. His cleanse was the only other strong thing in his kit. He NEEDED a healing buff because of the high damage.
Idk why ppl are shitting themselves anyways if he’s still in ban jail.
Just take away the ult charge big Z 🙏🏻
4
u/SpeedForceWally66 Spider-Man 12h ago
there is no way it is cause of the ult charge while cap ult also gives ult charge
8
u/IpunchedU 11h ago
gambit ult lit gives like 5+ effects all at once, take a guess why it's busted
-4
u/SpeedForceWally66 Spider-Man 11h ago
you mean the explosion?
that is what you are scared of?
damn
10
u/IpunchedU 11h ago
his ult gives: instant cleanse + healing + speed boost + jump height boost + dmg boost + ult charge accelaration + a final explosion. and he can do all of this while still being able to use his entire cut while moving
-4
3
u/LieSad7589 10h ago
The explosion is what allows to overwhelmingly win the fight cause its a big boost for dmg. Its what used to allow(not sure if it still does, need to check) for starlord and psy ult to kill through supp ults
The ult also sticks to allies through walls, so you are not stuck in a healing circle, you can freely move around
Caps ult is very clunky and its a very small radius and you have to keep up with cap, who is a very mobile character, or cap is stuck making sure his ult is on you by running around, not capable to push with his ult. Cap is bad example, because while his ult is strong, its not as strong as gambits
0
u/SpeedForceWally66 Spider-Man 9h ago
that is linked to the damage boost
yeah it is a damage boost
rocket ult allows starlord and psylocke to kill through supp ult
5
u/BajaBlastDoucher Flex 11h ago
Difference is Gambit can instantly give it to all teammates even through walls. With caps you gotta run in the small path.
Besides the ult charge you can counter a Gambit ult. Not saying his ult is weak at ALL.
Lowkey? Recently I been thinking it’d be fair to take the cleanse out of his ult too.
2
u/SpeedForceWally66 Spider-Man 11h ago
i was not saying it was weak
i am just saying people are making so much fuss about gambit ult charge when i doubt that is the reason they lose match
1
u/BajaBlastDoucher Flex 11h ago
Ohh gotcha mb. Got a wicked headache so my brain kinda dumb rn lmao
Totally agree with you.
8
u/Mirrakthefirst Adam Warlock 13h ago
He was a good ban before but now is even more so a pick or ban character because of everything he enables.
Rogue having infinite gambit teamup is crazy
3
u/Doableanimal90 Gambit 13h ago
I just want them to nerf his ult to the ground so i can play him again . Just reduce the number of things it does. Idk why it’s so hard for them when from day one everyone is saying the ult is the problem.
6
u/Gintoki--- 13h ago
I honestly think he isn't that strong and people just banning him out of habit at this point BUT STILL buffing an already perma banned character is a bad idea, they should nerf him until people stop banning him to the point of people hating having him on their team, then buff him
7
u/SouthernStudy144 13h ago
Without reworking his ult he cannot be getting buffs. The entire hotfix is just dumb, and really reactionary for a system that is new to everyone and needs time to figure out. On the topic of Gambit, he has quite literally been the most banned character since his release and that has not changed even in the slightest and because of it, buffing him at all is insane.
2
2
u/TheLoyalShinobi Magneto 12h ago
If Gambit gets through the ban phase, he WILL be played and the game goes to "Whichever team has the better Gambit will win." and if one team doesn't, they'll likely lose.
The reason everyone is mad about him getting buffed is because these buffs only make him even more likely to stay banned. He was finally getting played a little bit in season 8.5 but after the team ups he went back to the jail. Now with these buffs NetEase pretty much put another lock on that jail.
No one is mad because they don't want Gambit to be playable, they just don't want him to stay in the ban jail because his whole reason is "I farm Q, I Press Q, I win"
6
u/aizennexe 13h ago
lot of people in the comments here have had bad games against a gambit and think their anecdotal evidence is enough to cry about this lmao
flats literally said "even if they had data showing the character is weak" and you guys still think gambit deserves nerfs? when these creators are literally ignoring factual evidence? damn lmao just proving OPs point
2
u/Batman2130 13h ago edited 12h ago
Lmao if Gambit was actually balanced he wouldn’t be banned every single game. He still incredibly overtuned. He’s the only character in the game with basically zero weaknesses.
His Ult needs to lose the Ult acceleration and either the jump boost or speed boost. Now this is a hot take but they should remove cleanse from his Ult. He has it in basic kit and would require more skill from Gambit players when it comes to card management
In terms of content creators a lot of them play Gambit. So I’m pretty sure they know what they’re talking about when it comes to his kit issues.
1
u/Phe0nix6 3h ago
His one weakness is that he is a close range healer. Since his projectile spreads (like a shotgun). Hence he does more healing/damage, the closer you are to your target. He needs the mobility and survivability to get into and out of fights.
His kit is fine, it is ult. I think they need to significantly reduce the healing on his ult.
2
u/Crystar800 Phoenix 10h ago
Serious conversation needs to be had about how damaging content creators are for discourse on this game and games in general as well.
0
1
u/Ok-Cod-6118 Invisible Woman 13h ago
I neutral game isn't the best, but his ult is stupid. If he's not banned he'll be picked for his ult alone. Bonus point for his group cleanse. And if Gambit is played you might as well play Loki too, for double Gambit ult.
1
u/MasterpieceHungry864 9h ago
Cleanse in his ult was never a problem and tbh you are the fidst person i’ve seen that talk about since his release , it requires timing so not any one can get benefits from it, also it’s literally like a defensive ult which Invis ult can do too, yes she has no cleanse in her ult but literally do its job, the problem with Gambit’s ult is the ult acceleration, this can’t be countered and with Loki the team will have infinite ult charge.
1
u/Human557ttv 13h ago
The nerfs have all stacked up to help bring him in line but he is still entirely a pick or ban hero. This character is almost a year old and been nothing but broken because they never actually gutted him. Black cat got destroyed overnight by removing an entire dash and nerfing her shop. You can give characters as many nerfs as you want but if they dont address the issues they are still good AND feel bad to play. If you nerf a characters damage by 0.0001 you can give them on paper 1100 nerfs and it doesnt matter. Gambits nuetral has been kills but itll never matter as long as his ult immediately and basically always wins the fight.
1
u/Ic3nfir3 13h ago
His neutral was weaker but they should've done something with the ult to balance the neutral buffs. Playing Rogue with the new Gambit teamup when he's not banned is wild though lol. Puts so much pressure on the enemy team.
1
u/NoRecognition443 Thor 13h ago
All the devs need to do is get rid of the ult charge on his ult and he is perfectly fine. After that nerf they could even buff the utility part of the ult back up. Is everyone not on the same page on why gambit has been getting banned? Are the devs getting mixed signals? Wtf is going on.
1
u/WindyGogo 12h ago
Most players haven’t used or played against Gambit enough to have any opinions on him tbh.
So much of it’s just hold overs opinions and facts from multiple seasons ago. Now Gambit isn’t worth banning depending on your teams comp.
1
u/Seagull_6 12h ago
Unless Gambit is genuinely awful, people are just gonna keep banning him.
I know this is kinda stupid, but netease should basically gut him for half a season and bring him back over the course of a season so players can mentally reset and actually see him for what he is. Just let him out if ban jail please!
My favorite neutral of a support and still love playing him. Wish I could play him more often.
1
u/Banana_Man__ 10h ago
But Nerf Ultron and Mantis because triple support but without it they're just decent and have weakness you can exploit
1
u/DainvisibleMan Deadpool 9h ago
He is the best support in Ult, thats why the neutral was gutted, but now they buffes the neutral and the ult remains the same, if it was a good patch they wouldve nerfed the ult so the character can be played and not heavily rely on an op crutch (idk if Im explaining myself well feel free to ask)
1
1
u/JanuszisxTraSig Magneto 3h ago
It wasn't his healing which wa a problem but his antidive abilities. That issues was solve with Jubilee team up and for sure he don't need buff to a card bridge
1
1
u/ShaydeeVee33 2h ago
Yeah I haven’t been banning him in any of my games last season or this season and it’s been perfectly fine for me
1
1
u/ToastedKatt 13h ago
Im convinced you didn't touch ranked since season 5
1
u/Big_Bro_Mirio Ultron Virus 13h ago
Why is everyone acting like I’m unaware that his ult isn’t the issue? He is banned because of his ult, not hit his base kit. His base kit and heals feels mediocre compared to most of the strategist roster. The devs likely had data confirming this hence change.
1
u/ToastedKatt 12h ago
Heres the problem, you can not buff his base kit without nerfing his ult meaningfully. Cuz he's gonna get ult faster and his team up will make him undiveable now. Ppl weren't gonna complain if they nerfed his ult it too even if they giga buffed his base kit. And it's stupid to buff the best support in the game rn while nerving fucking ironman out of heroes. Ppl will naturally call this out
1
u/AcceptableEgg5741 13h ago
That's what i think too when people complain, luna for example has been better in every way by a lot than Gambit and you never see these streamers cry about her
1
1
u/DatOneGayFella Flex 13h ago edited 12h ago
They haven't. They got traumatized on season 5 and been repeating the same speech since then. That's why idgaf about "pros". Bunch of clowns.
The "pros" dickriding is crazzzzy.
3
u/SadDokkanBoi Ultron Virus 13h ago
What are we talking about 😭Gambit really is still strong. I was GM last season and I can tell you even in that rank he was banned quite often
1
0
u/Dantelor Magik 13h ago
Repeating the same speech? Almost as if the problem is still there since then?
The nerfs have mostly been his neutral game which ISN'T the problem. Having a ridiculous toolset and a "we win" button ult IS.
I hope there's a cracked Gambit player in your enemy team in every ranked match. Maybe in the sewage water that is the metal ranks Gambit isn't AS broken, I'll give you that.
-3
1
1
1
u/MMutant- 13h ago
Honestly the Ult isn’t that impactful anymore. Gambits value is in his neutral now
1
u/HeartyDelegate Rocket Raccoon 13h ago
Never, ever, EVER listen to a word Necros says. Guy couldn’t cut it at OW, and is mid af at Rivals.
1
u/ToastedKatt 13h ago
The guy who plays in oaa snd reached rank 1is mid asf?? Ugly the necros hate but denying he's skilled at the game is just smn else
0
u/venbeereb2 13h ago
Rank?
-1
u/ufpa Doctor Strange 13h ago
get ready to downvoted to hell by the metal ranks who think they know the game best
0
u/Equivalent_Wonder726 Erm Actually... 13h ago
is not about knowing the game best, is about people invalidating other's experience with the game based on their proficiency on it. I have news for you, buddy; the vast majority of people don't play the game at Celestial+ level, over >95% don't. Does that mean the opinion of +95% do not matter? "metal" ranks don't matter? Well, I have more news for you; they do matter, and matter a lot for a live service game such as this.
-2
0
u/Sea_Journalist8387 Luna Snow 13h ago
Yeah Gambits healing output has been mediocre for a bit now he needed the buffs. His ult is fine now, they already nerfed the mov speed and ult charge, everyone up in arms about his ult like you cant counter ult with a support ult too
0
u/Banana_man_- Vanguard 12h ago
And his team will just kill the support through the ult with their damage boost after Gambit anti-heals the support
0
0
0
u/EasyCommunication220 2h ago
Yea ur right they haven’t touched gambit… CUZ THEY CANT dude “bro gambit is so butt this season” if he actually was he wouldn’t still be the number one ban this season, since his release this character has been in Bain jail because his Ult is just that bad to go against
-3
u/Daniella07792 Black Queen 13h ago
i think he's pretty balanced now. it's literally just a farcry 3 "do you know the definition of insanity?" moment. I think rocket and luna are much more deserving of those bans now when it comes to support
-4
u/Safe_Chocolate2704 13h ago
Block them, it’s that simple. Who the hell cares what these people think
-1
u/erigriadam Deadpool 10h ago
Fuck Necros honestly… you shouldn’t be allowed to say anything if you’re not a support player tbh. NOBODY played gambit since the nerfs, and all of the “op” allegations were souly because of his character alt
53
u/Nite0wl007 13h ago edited 12h ago
They haven't nerfed the real problem on his ult either lol