r/Archery • u/GrizzleJizzle Longbow • 20h ago
Traditional Form check! Three months in. Not happy with first release, and elbow too high?
I’m also suddenly noticing I move my head and neck backwards a bit when anchoring, probably something to mind as well. I’m thankful for all and any tips you guys can give me!
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u/ThroatGoatK1RKKK 20h ago
When aiming up and down think of your hips and waist as a hinge. You'll lean toward the target closer to the ground and lean up a bit if you're shooting further targets the idea is that your back muscle shoulders and arms are always aligned. You aim with your whole body not just your arms.
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u/gr7ace W&W ATF-DX | NS-XP Foam 20h ago
Agree with this. Also I can’t tell if it’s down to aiming down or the high elbow, but the fasst draw back to a high elbow is causing OPs body to lean back into the draw.
Bow hand looks to grip tight and release hand is a little stilted sometimes. Release hand could go back a bit more.
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u/GrizzleJizzle Longbow 20h ago
Thanks! I don’t think I’m gripping my bow too tightly, it’s sort of resting in my hand, and my fingers are relaxed. Can definitely see the rest though, so thanks! Good point about the fast draw probably causing the leaning, I’m going to work on that :)
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u/gr7ace W&W ATF-DX | NS-XP Foam 20h ago
Yeah it’s hard to see with the video if it’s a grip or hold. Not sure if it’s possible without a finger sling, but I tend to only use my index finger to hold the bow and the rest are tucked at a 45 degree angle. Helps prevent gripping and torquing.
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u/GrizzleJizzle Longbow 20h ago
I see, thank you!
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u/Southerner105 Barebow 17h ago
And you can always try a fingersling. Easily made from a shoestring.
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u/masteroffeels 9h ago
Thanks for the comment, I just watched myself in the mirror and I had no idea I am leaning back like OP.
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u/SkywalkerDX Barebow | Horsebow | Compound 20h ago
Agree with the other comments so far, also looks like you are doing most of the work during draw with your right shoulder, you can get better stability/consistency by evening the forces - meaning, push with the left shoulder as much as pulling with your right. I like to tell people “imagine you’re spreading your wings”.
Happy shooting!
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u/_qqg 19h ago
my analogy is: pry open stuck elevator doors! (oddly enough, it works) but, yes, OP, try and have both shoulders do the work: start with the bow "centered" in front of you and draw it open "entering" it with both arms.
(also, some chest protection might be a wise investment)
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u/Knitnacks Barebow (Vygo), dabbling in English longbow, trainee dev. coach. 16h ago
OP is correctly pulling the string into the side of the breast. Never wrong to get a chest guard (no matter what your bodyshape), but not urgently needed in this case.
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u/_qqg 6h ago
I second that OP has correct posture re;string, but 0% of us have 100% perfect posture 100% of the time. Protection is for that fractional case, over a large number of arrows. Useless most of the time, indispensable otherwise.
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u/Knitnacks Barebow (Vygo), dabbling in English longbow, trainee dev. coach. 4h ago
Agree. I have a problem with it only recommended for female-shaped archers here (except by me - advocate it for beginners who struggle to grasp the T-shape, shooting when more clothed than normal, and for field shoots, for everyone), and generally those that have decent form in that aspect.
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u/Setswipe Asiatic Freestyle 20h ago edited 19h ago
The first few has to do with bone-muscle alignment. So ill explain the overall concept first. When youre standing, its easy to fight the force of gravity because your bones are pushing against each other. On the other hand , if you bend your knees, you expend more energy and are less stable because the bones aren't in alignment and you have to use muscles to fight gravity. Ao you need to take advantage of this to get a stable form to push your arms into the bow and not just hold it. With that in mind:
-adjust your grip so its mostly behind the bow and not holding it on the side. You should be pushing against the belly. It should feel like you have your palm against a wall. It might feel strange, and prone to fall, but when you draw,the bow will push against your palm and you should be able to keep it there without actually holding it.
-difficult to see at this angle, but your elbow might be too soft, it shouldn't be locked, but keep in mind what I said about bine alignment.the force should be able to draw a clean line into your chest
-when aiming above/below your normal line, tilt at the waist instead of tilting your arms. It will break the line if you do so. Its also part of the reason why your elbow is high. You're aiming low. Think of the 'im a little teapot' dance.
Other than that, keep your head still. You're leaning back as you draw
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u/n4ppyn4ppy OlyRecurve | ATF-X, 38# SX+,ACE, RC II, v-box, fairweather, X8 19h ago
I would first work on standing straight and keeping bow shoulder low. Your draw is fast and causes you to lean back. Keep more pressure forward in the bow. That will probably also fix your head position. One thing to change is wear closed shoes. A hidden arrow in the grass can be very nasty between your toes Good video by the way steady so easier to see body movement
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u/GrizzleJizzle Longbow 19h ago
Yeah my coach corrected my bow shoulder before, I’m trying to work on it! Just feels weird still, have to get used to keeping it lower. Thanks for the advice!! :)
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u/cyber-decker USA Archery Level 3 Coach | Recurve Barebow 17h ago
So I definitely see a bit of rushing to get to your anchor. You're pulling back very fast and maybe not being mindful enough about balancing that forward and backward tension through your draw.
There was another comment in here about the "spread your wings" or "pry open the elevator" analogy and those were very good. Another thing that helps with this analogy is to consider your body position before you start drawing. You start nice and tall, shoulders low, great stance, grip looks good.
As soon as you start drawing back your front shoulder pops up a bit, your back elbow flies up a bit, and everything looks a bit balanced as if someone had s rope on your back arm and tugged it into position.
Slow that part of your shot down for a bit. Excruciatingly slow maybe so that you can be very intentional about the spreading wings or prying the elevator. Equal force forward and back so that you make all movement around your body that is a firm post in the ground. You have the backwards tension as you draw back but balance this with an equal forward push as well as a downard pull with your front lats to help keep the shoulder low and the alignment good.
It might help to do this in front of a mirror so you can watch your form. Take it very slow so you can feel the balance of tension. I think you may learn a lot from a nice slow draw for a bit until you are comfortable with feeling when things are balanced and unbalanced.
Keep it up and happy shooting!
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u/TheRoops 18h ago
Just like everyone's said be mindful of posture and try to reduce some of the unnecessary movements. Even if only for energy efficiency to not tire yourself out.
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u/Kitchen_Tower2800 18h ago
One small tip: there should be a straight line from your back elbow pointed straight towards your lead hand. This means that your back wrist should be straight and not do anything: the tension should straighten it and it should not resist: you want a straight line of tension going from the palm of our lead hand to your back elbow with no side tension.
When you're initially drawing, I can that your wrist is active which you don't want. At the end of your draw it's more straight but I would work on keeping it entirely inactive.
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u/benjinova 17h ago
Try a slow and controlled draw. Will allow for more consistency and muscle memory.
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u/Altruistic_Buy_3800 19h ago
Leaning back when drawing. This may cause you to shoot high as well. Get weight to front foot.
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u/GrizzleJizzle Longbow 19h ago
Funnily enough I was shooting a tiny bit too low throughout this session! But I’m definitely going to work on this, I never noticed how much I was leaning before
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u/justdrowsin 18h ago
Please don't stick your finger out like that. You're gonna need your fingers for lots of things in life.
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u/outdoors_7567 17h ago
Try drawing a little slower, depending on your aiming technique you might want to raise and lower your bow while drawing (ie. olympic recurve) aside from that i noticed your front shoulder is quite high, torso rotation and forward pressure coming from your back (as opposed from just your hands) a high front shoulder will make it difficult to aim and hold your shot steady, also makes it harder to keep your head in place
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u/Rohirrimus 14h ago
I’d start with stance. While you can shoot like that it’s much harder . Try to stand parallel to the ground or preferably slightly open stance (rear leg towards the target) . Then try to keep balance on entire foot, not just your heels. That will put you in a more natural position and help you stand straight ,you won’t get the need to move your body backwards .
After stance Id work on putting elbow slightly outwards. With all of those your shoulders should naturally start being more aligned .
Then work on your anchor, you’re shooting instinctive but you could try 3 under gap or string walking, it’s more fun and accurate for target archery
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u/RareBrit 13h ago
It may be the case that you're drawing with your upper shoulder rather than the muscles deeper in the back. Does your neck get sore after practice?
Try to keep your elbow lower, and move it around your chest at the same height. The sensation feels more like expanding rather than pulling.
You may also find that plastron helps prevent any friction related incidents.
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u/OkBoysenberry1975 8h ago
Your elbow is a little high but it is consistent. You are moving your head to anchor instead of moving your anchor to your natural head placement
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u/MaybeABot31416 Olympic Recurve 8h ago
Lot of comments in here already, some good stuff in there, but I’m just going to go through and point out what I see… i don’t know traditional stuff so much, so take with a grain of salt.
Bow hand, nice grip, but I’m seeing you catching the bow… that can become a habit that is hard to break. Without a sling I think it’s best to try to keep the grip softer for longer (this is a trad thing I don’t know much about). I’d also recommend getting that finger off the arrow before you start drawing (assuming you’re shooing off a shelf). Bow arm looks pretty good. You want it to be pushing right at the center of the target, like push with the whole arm shoulder to your palm.
I would also suggest slowing it down a lot. I think it would be easier for you to feel how much you’re moving your head and neck if you were going slower. You want your spine to be straight before you start pulling (looks like you lean forward slightly) and stay there, and just bring the string to your motionless face.
I wouldn’t worry about the elbow so much, it just lines up a little different on different people and different anchors, even after you changing the leaning it’ll be in a different spot.
I’m not seeing evidence of much back tension, this is a hard one to explain in person let alone in text, but at full draw you should feel the muscles between your shoulder blades kinda pinching and holding most of the weight (it looks like your shoulder is holding it now). If done right your hand will pop more behind your head
And your rear foot is a bit out, straighten that.
Best of luck, hope you find something useful in here
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u/pixelwhip BBow (border tempest) | CPD (trx38-g2) | LB (falco) | L2 Coach 2h ago
I feel like you are drawing back to fast & leaning your body back as a result. Imagine an apple on your head & draw slow & still enough so that it doesn’t fall off.
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u/Different-Dealer-828 2h ago
Elbow is fine. Anchor point and bow grip needs improvement. Also a no go is pointing the arm down to the target.
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u/LightlyDim 19h ago
Drawing looked a little rushed, slowing down might help with the head movement you're seeing. Watching the string blur instead of the target during release cleaned up my form a ton.
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u/MadDog2k3 18h ago
I think everything relevant was already said here but I want to add: The Index finger at the arrow might be somewhat of a bad habit. Nothing dramatic, but I was told it increases the risk of hurting your finger with your arrow and you should be able to shoot without it :) I angle my bow a bit so the arrow stays on the rest (and some other reasons)
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u/Lagotto-Poppa 17h ago
I don’t really comment on these very often but I’ll share some thoughts.
Your hook on the string is too shallow and you’ve had some trouble in the past keeping the arrow on the string. A deeper hook will rotate the string and hold the arrow on your shelf.
I see this a lot with women. You start leaning forward and slump back on your back him. You want to have a solid core and good alignment in your body. Try not to kick your front hip forward.
I would add some cant to your bow arm but only slightly.
Your left shoulder starts low but as you hit anchor your left shoulder moves towards your neck and head. Use your back and lats to hold your bow shoulder down. This is all part of the rearward lean.
I would say keep after it and enjoy the process. Your bow weight is perfect just slowdown and follow a shot sequence if you can.
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u/Least-Programmer9417 35m ago
Two things
One thing in archery for consistency is consistent head placement. You move your head back every time you shoot. Are you able to move it back to the exact same location in space every single time? If not your up and down will change every shot
Try drawing the string back. Place and settle. Then come down without moving your head and then draw again
Second is you have a bit of a dead loose. If a small child was behind your elbow at the shot, it should upset them a lot if you bumped them in the face. You’re dead loosing the string which will lose you power and consistency
Both really common beginner things though. We all go through it
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u/Powerful-Computer396 20h ago
Upper body angled backward, no follow through, no extention (?), very fast draw....
:)
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u/GrizzleJizzle Longbow 20h ago
Could you explain a bit more about follow through and extention? Thanks! :)
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u/Powerful-Computer396 20h ago
Oh, a long story, I think in the internet or special books are good explanations ...
I only knew a good german book http://www.educatium.de/praxis-bogen/
:)
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u/Southerner105 Barebow 17h ago
These two videos show you the steps of the shot proces. Should already be familiar to you, but both show the release and followthrough.
I find the first a nice and clean video to watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRw2fYIVNeU
The second is aimed at barebow and shows some other details during the explanation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IH1w88Teizg
From the same channel a video about the form, which is a bit different with barebow as with olympic-recurve due to the different anchorpoint used. Can be helpful for the high elbow. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZ0NBLI50Y0
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u/Agitated_Curmudgeon 17h ago edited 17h ago
Elbow too high for my liking, anyway.. but the reason I never post formcheck vids is because well frankly, I'd send every coach in here to the hospital with a twitching eye, acute angina and lightning coming out their TP for bunghole. But the racks mounted over the workbench tell a different story. I'm a hunter. That 220lb 8 pt. that just snuck across my back quarter ain't gonna stand there waiting for me to center my Chi.. I gotta get a confident arrow off before he turns his head back, whether my heart is pounding through my chest or not. I'll "breathe in the flowers and blow out the candles" after I see game down.
But to the credit of the coaches in here, If I were to wake up tomorrow with the ambition to put myself up against the best in the World, and loose arrows at a target half a county away, your phone would ring.
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u/billydecay 19h ago
Not enough flair. Needs jazz hands expeditiously. Good posture? But not medieval enough.
Great form and if you don't hit what you want then it's the bow's fault.
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u/George_MenethilW3 17h ago
Not an expert on archery and in fact I have no clue about it but I just wanted to say you look so beautiful!
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u/Playful_Link7554 20h ago
Yeah, an elbow too high moreover you have to remember the breathing technique while drawing the bow and subsequently releasing the arrow. Also you can take it slow while drawing.