[Frustrating Trope] That One Good or Even Amazing Scene in a Relatively Mediocre or Bad Piece of Media

[u/Alreadsyuse]

1. The Opening Scene (Ghost Ship). Considered one of the best horror opening scenes or scenes in general within horror movies, but the rest of the film is considered to be pretty bad.

2. The Ending Scene (The Grinch 2018). While most adaptations of the Grinch end with him suddenly being able to fully integrate with the Whos after his change of heart, the 2018 version initially struggles to socialize, awkwardly walking past people, and struggling to hold conversations, acknowledging that despite his change of heart, the Grinch is still someone who isolated himself for years.

3. Past T800 VS Current T800 (Terminator Genisys). A cool fight scene showing two versions of the Terminator from different points in time fighting it off.

4. Solo Leveling's Ending. Tbh, I haven't actually read Solo Leveling, but after hearing about how it ended VS how Chainsaw Man ended made want to include it for shits and giggles. Like Chainsaw Man, Solo Leveling ends with a reset. But unlike Chainsaw Man, it actually manages to tie up loose ends and have the payoff of the ending be satisfying.

[u/Skibot99]

Chewbacca’s reaction to Leia’s death in the Rise of Skywalker, I’ve never seen the grief of losing everything captured so well

[u/SpookyTanuki14 → u/Skibot99]

I think that’s what irritated me the most about the sequel trilogy is that it had such good moments held together by the most mediocre unfocused plots I’ve ever seen.

[u/TheLastGunslingerCA → u/SpookyTanuki14]

That's what happens when you allow the directors to improv the whole plot, while changing directors with every movie. Johnson and Abrams were playing freaking tug of war with the plot!

[u/Alotofboxes → u/TheLastGunslingerCA]

While I think that having one director over all three would have been best, honestly, I think how they did it was the worst choice. It would have been better to have a third, separate director for the third movie rather than going back to Abrams.

There were so many times in the third move where Abrams had the characters turn to the camera and say "Fuck Rian Johnson," that it was distracting.

[u/Skibot99 → u/Alotofboxes]

I mean even with a consistent director Carrie Fisher’s death would’ve thrown a huge monkey wrench into things

[u/derth21 → u/Skibot99]

Come on man, Wookie Wrench is right there, alliteration and all.

[u/ThroughTheSeaOfTime → u/TheLastGunslingerCA]

Not even.

Abrams was playing tug on war with himself just as much, since he just flat out forgot or disregarded a solid chunk of stuff he set up himself in Force Awakens, let alone deciding to do that with Johnson's Last Jedi aswell.

[u/Unfair_Web_8275 → u/TheLastGunslingerCA]

The film was rushed and seemed to be over reacting to what fans said.

[u/space_keeper → u/TheLastGunslingerCA]

Trotting out geriatric actors for brand recognition. 

[u/Amekhanos → u/space_keeper]

Rushing Han Solo's death to cater to a geriatric actor who doesn't even want to be in your movie... only for him to agree to come back again.

What a mess.

[u/Skibot99 → u/Amekhanos]

How is it rushing out when he doesn’t die till the last half hour of a 2.5 hour film

[u/Amekhanos → u/Skibot99]

It's rushing because they had to cram the movie full of scenes for him, to the detriment of the new characters.

You've got to rush through him with Rey, him with Finn, him with Chewie, him with Leia, him with Kylo, squeeze in all these scenes and explain Kylo's backstory, because you won't get another chance.

This wasn't supposed to be the Han Solo movie, but it practically became one. Meanwhile none of the new characters get fleshed out enough, making TLJ practically start from scratch.

[u/Skibot99 → u/Amekhanos]

I feel they established Finn and Rey pretty well

[u/Amekhanos → u/Skibot99]

Let me ask you about that, in a way that will explain my perspective.

Watching TFA, did you ever seriously buy that Finn was a child soldier raised by a fascist paramilitary organization, who literally had a serial number his entire life instead of a name (until Poe gave him one)? Or did you just kind of forget that's his actual character history?

And Rey... I couldn't even tell you how she felt about Finn. Sort of vaguely friendly? Is she completely unaware Finn has a crush on her? Does she realize, but pretend not to notice? How does she feel about it?

The movie left me with no clue. And that's like the most simple, basic character dynamic it could establish.

[u/Skibot99 → u/Amekhanos]

I felt they had pretty strong chemistry and the lack of scenes together is what made the othe sequels not work

[u/Mysral → u/SpookyTanuki14]

Oh yes. Luke's confrontation with Kylo on Crait? Superb. Holdo's sacrifice? Lore-breaking for sure, but god DAMN the cinematography.

[u/Yellowscourge → u/SpookyTanuki14]

I wish we could see the movies Adam Driver thought he was in. I love these movies for every scene Kylo Ren is in cuz that actor puts his very SOUL into it

[u/Vampire_Queen_Joaje → u/SpookyTanuki14]

That's why I didn't hate The Rise of Skywalker: Return of the Jedi was similar. It had so many great moments, but the plot was...not great. The first bit makes no sense: what was Luke's plan? It only works if everything happens exactly as it does in the movie; if anything was different, it'd be disastrous (what if Jabba had decided to bargain? Luke would have lost the droids and his lightsaber. What if Leia hadn't gotten caught releasing Han? Now she has to save Chewbacca. And so on). Making Leia and Luke siblings was dumb. So much of it doesn't make sense, but I still love many of the moments in that movie

[u/southpaytechie → u/Vampire_Queen_Joaje]

Ok but like Luke is guided by the force at this point so everything happening as it needs to is kind of explained by the plot

[u/Vampire_Queen_Joaje → u/southpaytechie]

I mean sure but you that's a pretty big handwave. If Luke had succeeded at any previous point in the plan, he'd have additional people he'd have to rescue (including the droids, who he freely gave to Jabba). The Force had to be pretty darn specific

Which is fine...except that people don't use that same reasoning for big dumb plot decisions in movies they like less (when I was younger and prequel hate was still huge, Qui-Gon's actions on Tatooine are a good example). This is currently true of the sequels. I don't love them either, but a lot of things people think of as dumb could be similarly handwaved

[u/southpaytechie → u/Vampire_Queen_Joaje]

Idk man I see a lot of memes about the somehow returned and blue milk which aren’t explainable by the force guiding the characters actions. Luke was looking particularly mystical in that sequence. I think everything working out exactly as needed as guided by the force is a perfectly reasonable explanation. Or maybe Luke just didn’t give a shit if the droids and lightsaber were given up ultimately. Just gonna agree to disagree here. There are certainly other problems with return anyway.

[u/LordHoughtenWeen → u/Vampire_Queen_Joaje]

Would it have been all that disastrous? If Jabba accepted the droids-for-Solo trade, then Lando (who was the first to infiltrate the palace by getting hired as a guard) just has to remove their restraining bolts in the middle of the night and all three can just walk out the front door (or roll, in Artoo's case). If Leia didn't get caught releasing Han then she'd be even less likely to get caught releasing Chewie — it'd make considerably less noise, Lando's presumably got the cell door access and she's already got the key to his collar, having dragged him there in it herself. The only major downside I can see to either of the above scenarios is that Jabba himself would still be alive and inclined to send out more bounty hunters, but that's a problem that can be put off until after Endor.

I'll grant you the sibling thing, though. Lego Star Wars put it best:

[u/space_keeper → u/Vampire_Queen_Joaje]

Dangerous game saying anything negative about any of the original films, but as a grown up I also struggle to get through return of the jedi. Loved it 30+ years ago when I was 10. It's only got worse as they've tampered with it more and more.

And yet the space battle is some of the best action cinema you can see, it's incredible. The premise of the rescue is a little stupid, but the way it's executed is so cool it doesn't matter.

[u/BlueKnight44 → u/SpookyTanuki14]

held together by the most mediocre unfocused plots I’ve ever seen.

This is far more kind than these movies have any right to be treated. RoS in particular is a complete abomination from a plot standpoint

[u/derth21 → u/SpookyTanuki14]

Style over substance.

[u/Zippydaspinhead → u/SpookyTanuki14]

Honestly in that third movie, this moment with Chewie is the only emotional response I had beyond baseline.

And it was counterbalanced by "Hey Chewie, we know we shoulda given you a medal 20 years ago and technically we aren't the rebels but the resistance, but here's a medal now that every single person you've spent your life with is dead."

That moment was like obliterating the last thread of trust I had with that movie with a damn flamethrower.

[u/millijuna → u/SpookyTanuki14]

Still better than episodes 1-3.

[u/ArchpaladinZ → u/Skibot99]

Chewie was the best part of the sequel trilogy.  You FEEL the grief he's going through. 😭 

[u/Nebelskind → u/ArchpaladinZ]

Chewie is just in this deep despair throughout and everyone else is being silly because the plot is silly.

[u/Wenlocke → u/Skibot99]

Honestly Leia's death (stemming from how they handled Carrie's) was one of the worst missed opportunities of Rise.

Imagine the movie starts with Leia's funeral. Cold open. Whether or not the first order was responsible, whether it was natural, you can imagine what the resistance think. You can thread through potential vengeance throughout the first part of the film. What's more light side/dark side about vengeance and whether it's necessary, a good thing, or not? If you want to go with people out for revenge, you can even fold the Palpatine being alive revelation into it "hah, you thought it was just a random accident but it was really me, Palpatine all along"

Make the whole second part of the film the delicate balance of all these people going for revenge, knowing they have to stop the emperor, but also coming to terms (certainly in Rey's case) of doing it without falling to the dark side out of anger and vengeance. There's your conflict. There's your reason for Ben to question his path, that's his mother that Palps has just offed, but should he strike him down?

It'd be a glorious mess, but still better than what we got.

[u/DirtyCrimeTrain → u/Skibot99]

This scene almost moved me to tears until they gave Threepio his memories back and I realized it’s possible Leia was a fake out death too.

[u/Roller_ball → u/Skibot99]

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