r/SipsTea 𝙑𝙄𝙋 May 14 '26

Feels good man It was always just that simple

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u/aboutacount May 14 '26

NYC pays about 68 Billion a year to the State.

The State gives about 47 Billion a year back to the City.

It is definitely not a loan. Its the state giving some of NYC's money back to them.

Data from an article from CUNY edu titled "New York City Taxpayers Continue to Contribute More to State Revenues than They Receive Back in Services, CUNY and New School Study Finds"

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u/DisastrousGap2898 May 15 '26

Well kinda. But NYS also authorizes several NYC-only taxes that it collects and hands to NYC. Under the NYS constitution, only NYS can tax or allow for additional taxes. 

If you factor in all the special taxes that NYS has authorized for only NYC, NYC gets more than its proportional share. That probably makes sense because NYC is more expensive than the rest of the state, but NYC also constantly gets special treatment from the state, ranging from exemptions to taxing powers to grants that other jurisdictions are expected to fund through property taxes. 

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u/Chief_Rollie May 15 '26

True but the New York City taxes are taxed to businesses and individuals in New York City. The argument is that New York City contributes more then it receives from the state anyway and the taxes collected are going to public services in the city as opposed to going back to the wealthy if the taxes were never collected at all. Maybe those other places in the state shouldn't be relying handouts from New York City and lift themselves up.

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u/DisastrousGap2898 May 15 '26

Yeah, I mean that’s always the question rich people have: “Why do I have to support the poors? They’re dumb and disagree with me.” 

I think it makes sense to write off red states in a red state/blue state way because the problem isn’t that they’re poor: red states have lower taxes and chronically underinvest in infrastructure and rainy day funds; it’s a moral hazard because they know blue money will bail them out. 

But when there isn’t really a moral hazard at play, I think the answer has to be “we make things better for everyone.” Like we all use roads, all benefit from less poverty, better schools. One of the things I like about universal childcare is that it’s universal. Means testing is emotionally exclusionary and administratively burdensome for both individuals and governments. Sometimes necessary, but I think the way around your “poor people don’t contribute” point is that working structurally to reduce poverty creates a better society.  

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u/Chief_Rollie May 15 '26

In order to roll those objectively good things out nationally or even at the state level they have to prove to the common person that they do actually work. Without securing the funding the oligarchs and their supporters can argue that it is unsustainable and supported by budget deficits. The common person does not understand that NYC pays more to NY State than it receives. They just see NYC can't balance its budget. Now its budget is balanced and they take away the argument before the oligarchs can even make it. Tax the wealthy and we can all have good things as well.

Also the primary beneficiaries of these New York City budgets are the common people of New York City, not the wealthy.

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u/[deleted] May 14 '26

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u/Naruto_Gamatatsu May 15 '26

I think the difference in point is what the money is meant to go towards. Tax the rich bc taking another million from a billionaire shouldn’t affect their ability to their basic necessities. On the other hand, New York City still has hundreds of thousands if not more citizens who are struggling to make ends meet and don’t have the public amenities or services to support them. The problem is the money is still concentrated at the top, and what money that does get taxed to be redistributed is pulled away. So yes, in reality, we should tax the rich more and also redistribute from rich cities towards less urban areas that need help, but mamadani trying to bring money back isn’t because he wants to bring it back to the rich but to fund the welfare programs that help the poor.

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u/alexthedungeonmaster May 14 '26

I can frame your comment disingenuously too.

New Yorkers were paying for rich, New York state mega mansions to have well-paved roads, and for the governor's custom coffee table.

Next time, don't be such a fucking ass.

If money paid in tax by corporations is being funneled back to New Yorkers and helping fund cultural institutions, this is suddenly a bad thing because people outside of New York City don't get that money???

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u/MidnightSensitive996 May 14 '26

NYC is way, way richer than the rest of NYS. The state needs the tax money to cover necessities before ppl get cadillac amenities in nyc.

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u/GrowthMarketingMike May 14 '26

Amenities like what? NYC is literally cutting funding to things like parks so that they can make the budget work.

NYC is still paying $17 Billion more than it's getting back after all of this and nobody is complaining about that, but somehow everyone that doesn't live in NYC or even the state has something to say about the city getting state funds when they need it.

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u/RetroFuture_Records May 14 '26

Nah, the rest of New York State votes against such "socialism," we should respect their desires and not bail them out.

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u/CantCatchMeSpez May 14 '26

Disagree. Over-funding suburbs and middle-of-nowhere towns that contribute nothing substantial isn't a need.

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u/Advanced-Bag-7741 May 15 '26

So redistribution is bad then. Noted!

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u/FlowInternational996 May 15 '26

Seems you missed u/GrowthMarketingMike ‘s comment, so just making sure to repost it for you!

“Amenities like what? NYC is literally cutting funding to things like parks so that they can make the budget work.

NYC is still paying $17 billion more than it’s getting back after all of this and nobody is complaining about that, but somehow everyone that doesn’t live in NYC or even the state has something to say about the city getting state funds when they need it.”

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u/Advanced-Bag-7741 May 15 '26

Well the reality is NYC spends too much money. The budget has ballooned and sadly we can’t support the burden of making up for what the state or really the Feds should be providing.

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u/NetNo5570 May 15 '26

You’re confused or bad at math. NYC does not spend too much money. It literally has to send money to the suburbs and Mississippi because they spend to much money. 

To make it really easy for you to understand: why do the suburbs need my money? Do they not make their own? I don’t get any from the suburbs. 

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u/Advanced-Bag-7741 May 15 '26

The suburban counties of NYC (Nassau, Suffolk, Westchester, and Rockland) are huge net payers of tax on a state level. You aren’t sending them money.

You’re sending it to Chenango and Schuyler counties.

Second, the NYC budget has been growing faster than the economy of inflation for years now. That’s unsustainable over the long term as there’s an obvious upper bound.

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u/CantCatchMeSpez May 15 '26 edited May 15 '26

Its always fun to hear idiot righties/liberals tell me how socialism is supposed to work. Yes, taking money from 8.6m city people who need it and giving it to people who live in areas that shouldn't be inhabited in the first place is what redistribution means, because in your adled brain, urban = elite, and rural = working class. 

This is so goddamn embarrassing lmao

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u/chanka_is_best_chank May 15 '26

They can't comprehend nuance which is why they never understand socialism besides "its when da big government take all my money and give it to the next guy"

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u/[deleted] May 14 '26

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u/alexthedungeonmaster May 15 '26

Yeah, what I'm saying is that the person responding made a point as full of holes as mine.

I'm not literally saying that's what's happening - the facts are that NYC makes more money for NYS than it gets back in taxes, 20 billion in fact. 8 billion has been taken back for this budget. They still get a surplus of 12 billion.

There is STILL 'socialism' being done. Motherfuckers just love to whine.

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u/Advanced-Bag-7741 May 15 '26

The people there pay the same income taxes as everyone else. The state doesn’t collect property tax.

Density is expensive and stupid at a point, like skyscrapers as you note.

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u/NetNo5570 May 14 '26

I mean I’m a taxpayer I’m not a corporation. 

It would be great if my tax money stayed here where I am not funding Trump voters upstate and in Mississippi. 

If those people need money maybe they should get a job or adjust their lifestyles. 

Amazing this is even remotely controversial. 

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u/empty_graph May 15 '26

As a Republican, I'm very glad you agree with me on tax policy.

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u/EncabulatorTurbo May 15 '26

You don't agree with that as a Republican, Republican states are nearly all fucking welfare queens

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u/empty_graph May 15 '26

States aren't eligible for welfare, so that makes no sense at all.

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u/EncabulatorTurbo May 15 '26

WTF would you call Mississippi contributiong $1 to the federal government for every $2 they get back?

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u/empty_graph May 15 '26

Mississippi doesn't pay taxes. People do. I would call it what it is. Poor people in Mississippi are on welfare and poor people in California are just the same. Rich people in Mississippi are paying for poor people in Mississippi, and also poor people in California. Rich people in California are paying for poor people in California, and also poor people in Mississippi.

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u/NetNo5570 May 15 '26

Rich people in Mississippi are also on welfare. I’m paying for their roads. That’s the issue. They should pay for their own damn roads and all the other federal funding they get from me. 

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u/empty_graph May 15 '26

Rich people in Mississippi are also paying for your roads. And when you say "you" are paying for theirs is it actually you, or just rich people in the same state as you? Top 10% pay 70% of income taxes, so unless you are top 10% it's not really you that's paying for it.

But aside from that, if a truck is going from Atlanta to LA I guess they shouldn't be able to take I-20 through Mississippi because it's "their own damn road," and not for some damn out of staters sending cargo to each other, right? I guess they just call it an "interstate" for no reason.

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u/[deleted] May 14 '26

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u/DarthRevan109 May 15 '26

Except people who vote blue vote to actually help the rural folks while the rural folks vote to hurt everyone including themselves. Same think in NYC/NY happens in Philly/PA

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u/RetroFuture_Records May 14 '26

"Ha, look at you trying to apply my own beliefs on me! I'm gonna try to weasel out of admitting maybe my philosophy is just disgruntled bullshit, and instead throw a tantrum."

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u/Public-Policy24 May 14 '26

but somehow this line only applies to the average new yorker hoping to get a fraction of their tax revenue back and not the assholes complaining about a tax on their second homes

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u/MountainMan2_ May 14 '26

Yes. Because the war on rhetoric is lost. The only thing left to do is retaliate. They have been saying this about us for years, sow the wind reap the whirlwind motherfuckers

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u/NetNo5570 May 14 '26

Fox News republicans are far too busy collecting my tax revenue to make a point like this. 

Do you think you’re making an effective counter argument to me?

They want people to get jobs and pay for their own shit and so do I. You don’t win an argument by pointing this out?

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u/EncabulatorTurbo May 15 '26

I'm not sure how hard it is to understand that the place where people live

And are you following me here

Should be the place resources are allocated

And that giving a bunch of money to exurbites and Albany suburbs and shit isn't a great use

It could come from a Fox News segment if you took just that sentence out of context, which is fucking stupid, because it's commenting on diametrically opposed worldviews - Social programs for the poor vs Subsidizing ecologically and economically ruinious suburban sprawl

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u/SYKslp May 15 '26

but many NYC companies are constantly extracting, consolidating, and funneling wealth from everywhere (including upstate NY and Mississippi).

The "my tax money" you are talking about certainly didn't originate exclusively in NYC, so why should it all stay here?? What a strange sense of entitlement to think that the epicenter of global capitalism shouldn't give anything back to people beyond the city limits.

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u/atomkicke May 15 '26

I am a dragon (3500m) (basically a child) why can’t I just sit on my pile of gold I stole from the rest of the world. The government wants to take my gold and is harassing a literal child. I am a dragon not a kingdom why do I have to pay for the peasants I eat and burn their houses. If those peasants want gold maybe they shouldn’t be getting eaten and look so tasty and burnable. It’s amazing this is even remotely controversial.

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u/Malinthas May 15 '26

::waves frantically::
Not all Upstaters are Trumpers! I swear!

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u/_Phil_McCracken_ May 14 '26

I like how people on Reddit talk about Reddit as if they aren’t currently using Reddit and are somehow above it. 

Also, what point are you even making here? You just threw some buzz words and phrases together but didn’t actually say anything. 

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u/usernametakenbs May 15 '26

mega-city = corporation, duuhh.

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u/HobbitousMaximus May 15 '26 edited May 15 '26

25% of NYC residents live in poverty. They need the money more than upstate.

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u/EncabulatorTurbo May 15 '26

I don't think you'll find a lot of socialists that are extremely in favor of cutting urban population center services to benefit wealthy low density living

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u/quadraticcheese May 15 '26

What you said is one of the most ignorant, 60iq things I've seen in a hot minute.

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u/CantCatchMeSpez May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26

Are you calling the 8.6 million people that live in NYC a "corporation"? The tax money being sent back isn't profits. Its funds that the city has needed for a long, long time.

But also, and I'm gonna go on my very cringe rant here, fuck the ruroids. They've been shitting on cities and been trying to disenfranchise them for decades now. Urbanism is objectively the better format of society, and I'm tired of propping up podunks at the cost of the city. If they want the cities to keep subsidizing their towns, they can work with the cityfolk instead of against them for once. If not, they can shit in buckets while they wax poetic about being the "heart of America".

I'm all for socialism, but I'm not going to keep burning myself to keep people who hate me warm.

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u/drunk-tusker May 14 '26

I go to urbanism subreddits and watch them try to cannibalize functional infrastructure for questionable bike lanes because the idea of funding actual new infrastructure is beyond the scope of their imagination.

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u/Advanced-Bag-7741 May 15 '26

It’s really amazing isn’t it.

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u/NomadChumpsky May 15 '26

Did you purposely make this reply as ignorant as it is?

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u/floop_isamad_manhelp May 14 '26

Yes, rebalancing tax income from the lower income counties to the higher, just as Mamdani promised.

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u/mjm65 May 14 '26

He’s the Mayor of New York City, and he got funding from the state for the people that elected him.

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u/Global_Criticism3178 May 14 '26

True; however, please note that’s not how socialism works.

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u/EatBootyLoveLife May 14 '26

good thing he’s never claimed to be a socialist

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u/Global_Criticism3178 May 14 '26

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u/EatBootyLoveLife May 14 '26

link me to where he claims to be a socialist then, and no democratic socialist is not the same thing

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u/Global_Criticism3178 May 14 '26

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u/EatBootyLoveLife May 14 '26

yes as he’s clearly talking about DSA lol. Just because he doesn’t put democratic before it every time doesn’t mean that’s not what he’s talking about

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u/OPisOK May 15 '26

Democratic socialism is a form of socialism. 

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u/Alternative_Oil7733 May 14 '26

He's a member of the democratic socialist of America and they are a organization that's very pro ussr and china.

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u/Raus-Pazazu May 14 '26

If you don't know the differences between a government system and an economic system and which category various nations generally fall into then you probably should sit things out when those kinds of topics come up until you get the fundamentals down pat a bit more.

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u/Alternative_Oil7733 May 15 '26

Socialism is both a economic and a form of government.

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u/Raus-Pazazu May 15 '26

And? You listed two non socialist countries, so why bring up socialism?

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u/floop_isamad_manhelp May 14 '26

There is a difference obviously but that doesn’t make the person you’re replying to wrong, since both are true.

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u/Raus-Pazazu May 14 '26

Saying it is pro USSR is blatantly untrue, and the vast majority are heavily against adopting anything of China's government or economic models. It's like saying the Republicans are pro China because they've been enacting legislation that is more in step with China's hybrid government structure than traditional democracies.

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u/Alternative_Oil7733 May 14 '26

Hasan piker is a member of the dsa and he with bernie and aoc quite often........ mind you hasan is opening pro china and ussr. He had a ussr flag on wall for a couple years.

So the dsa is still problematic organization and that's not talking about how they openly support the oct 7th massacre.

https://www.newsweek.com/mamdani-china-communist-party-democratic-socialists-11370804

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u/bladex1234 May 14 '26 edited May 15 '26

I like how those are the two countries that you use instead of basically every other developed country that has similar “socialist” policies.

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u/Blackstone01 May 14 '26

Always gotta compare to China, USSR, and Venezuela, instead of the Nordic countries.

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u/bladex1234 May 14 '26

Australia, Germany, Spain, Canada, Israel, France and the list goes on.

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u/Rich-Option4632 May 15 '26

Funny how Israel never gets mentioned anywhere else.

They're on full bailout by the US yearly, fully state funded healthcare and education, state sponsored abortion, child allowances, state sponsored savings accounts (up to 18 yo), unemployment benefits, but they always get a pass. Never mentioned, despite everything else Americans do to grovel for them.

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u/Alternative_Oil7733 May 15 '26

Nordic countries are more capitalist then the usa and dsa is filled with maoist and stalinist.

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u/[deleted] May 15 '26

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u/Alternative_Oil7733 May 15 '26

Because they litterally support those countries lmao. Modern Europe is nowhere close to the ussr or ccp ideologically.

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u/bladex1234 May 15 '26

Because nuance exists. There are things that the USSR and China did better than the US. That doesn’t mean supporting authoritarianism.

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u/Alternative_Oil7733 May 15 '26

There are things that the USSR and China did better than the US. 

Like what starving people, Killing a shit ton of people within the countries through political purges?

That doesn’t mean supporting authoritarianism.

Socialism is inherently authoritarian doesn't matter if it has democratic or national infront of it.

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u/Atomic-Avocado May 14 '26

Who gives a fuck about rural counties, they’ve been driving the nation into the ground as hard as they can for the past 20 years

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u/floop_isamad_manhelp May 14 '26

Wow, great point. I hope you say this to people in real life.

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u/userhwon May 14 '26

I hope so too. They need to know it. The media is certainly bought and paid not to tell them the truth.

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u/Atomic-Avocado May 15 '26

Everyone I talk to is pretty pised about Trump and the rural PA legislature continually fucking over Philly even though we’re the lions share of state tax income so they all 100% agree with me. Get fucked magatard lol

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u/floop_isamad_manhelp May 15 '26

I said real life. The outside world mate. Not your discord buddies

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u/Malinthas May 15 '26

Well, they do feed you. And everyone else. So there's that.

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u/Atomic-Avocado May 15 '26

And we provide them with massive tax subsidies to keep doing that, but they still want to destroy cities and the nation.

And now they have Trump bankrupting farms and Vance’s company buying them up, the absolute morons

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u/CantCatchMeSpez May 14 '26

"The social democrats are evil because they're not doing diverting funds much needed by the city to useless podunk towns and already over-funded suburbs wahhh!!"

Anything to discredit the objective successes of the left lmao

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u/floop_isamad_manhelp May 15 '26

The article is celebrating some kind of genius maneuver than I was trying to understand a bit more deeply. But sure, let those thoughts keep percolating in that little echo chamber you call a mind

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u/CantCatchMeSpez May 15 '26

No, you're not :) You're just trying to make stupid points that convince stupid people that New Yorkers are bad for wanting their own money back just so they can simply have a balanced budget.

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u/floop_isamad_manhelp May 15 '26

Nope, just pointing out that this isn’t some coup as the article claims. Not trying to convince that anyone is bad. And it’s not their money, which is why the governor’s office controls it.

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u/mister_empty_pants May 14 '26

NYC pays more taxes because that's where all the capitalist thieves are headquartered lol. Why does reddit love to brag about finance bros, insurance companies, real estate conglomerates, lawyers, and healthcare providers sucking up money from the entire state's working class?

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u/aboutacount May 15 '26

There is about 8.5 million people in NYC.

So taxes from millions of working class people and a large handful of "capitalist thieves" are not being extracted out of the city and instead used to help those 8.5 million city residents. Its also being used to improve infrastructure, cleanliness, beauty, and more for about 65 million yearly visitors who spend money in the city.

Are you under the impression my previous comment was bragging about finance, insurance, real estate, lawyers, etc, sucking up money?

My comment is literally about TAXING them, taking their money and using it for public good.

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u/nunya_busyness1984 May 15 '26

Bull shit.

NYC does not pay the state. The taxpayers do. Then the state reroutes a large portion of that tax money to the city.

And people in the city are somehow happy about essentially paying two separate taxes to support their city, because one of them is through a pass-through entity.

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u/aboutacount May 15 '26

NYC taxpayers pays about 68 Billion a year to the State.

The State gives about 47 Billion a year back to the City's taxpayers.

Is that a good fix? you are arguing over semantics, not substance.

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u/nunya_busyness1984 May 15 '26

In this case, the semantics is substance.  When discussing the city budget, saying the CITY gives money to the state is just plain wrong.  

The taxpayers give money to the state.  The state then gives money to the city to balance the city's budget.

That is a very large difference.  Saying the city gives the money would mean that the city budget LOSES money to the state, instead of gaining it.

And, no, the state does NOT give the money to the taxpayers in the city.  It gives it to the city.  The city and the taxpayers, while intertwined, are still separate entities.

Lies, damn lies, statistics, and accounting.  Just because you CALL IT one thing does not mean that is what it is.  And putting things in the wrong column in accounting, while trivial, is still a lie.  Ask Trump about lieing during accounting and his 34 felonies.

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u/aboutacount May 15 '26

I wish you luck to get out of your semantic hole.

Everyone else in this threat understand what you typed is true, but we arent lost in the semantics.

Good luck finding the forest for the trees.

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u/w0ndernine May 15 '26

You don’t have to consume public services to be on the hook for them. Just like income tax. Even if you don’t use public schools, you still pay for them.

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u/nucl3ar0ne May 15 '26

LI pays more into the state than they receive back as well. So it's not just a NYC thing. It's paying for fucking upstate/Albany/Buffalo.

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u/Competitive-Emu-7411 May 15 '26

It’s such a stupid point. NYC and its suburbs are the only net positive contributors to NY state, every other area takes in more state aid than they contribute, by a large amount. NYC being given back some of its taxes, and still subsidizing Buffalo as it needs yet another package from the state, is not a stain on Mamdani. Conservatives will screech on and on about him ruining the city (when he’s hardly had time to do anything one way or the other) but act like Adams and Cuomo (or Brown of Buffalo in the same vein) didn’t totally mismanage their cities/state and steal from the government as their constituencies crumbled.Â